Correlation between musical preference and intelligence/gender

General philosophy message board for Discussion and debate on other philosophical issues not directly related to veganism. Metaphysics, religion, theist vs. atheist debates, politics, general science discussion, etc.
User avatar
Jebus
Master of the Forum
Posts: 1776
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2014 2:08 pm
Religion: None (Atheist)
Diet: Vegan

Correlation between musical preference and intelligence/gender

Post by Jebus » Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:46 pm

I've been curious about this for a while. Although there has been research about this in the past, it is unclear of whether or not the musical preference has to do with intelligence or environment. Although anecdotally I sense an intellectual correlation, I am even more curious in gender difference, i.e.men are much more likely to enjoy, for example, prog music than women, in my experience.

Calling @Dream Sphere on this one.
How to become vegan in 4.5 hours:
1.Watch Forks over Knives (Health)
2.Watch Cowspiracy (Environment)
3. Watch Earthlings (Ethics)
Congratulations, unless you are a complete idiot you are now a vegan.

Frank Quasar
Junior Member
Posts: 64
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2018 10:10 am
Religion: None (Atheist)
Diet: Vegan

Post by Frank Quasar » Wed Sep 05, 2018 3:14 pm

What kind of music are you interested in?

User avatar
Jebus
Master of the Forum
Posts: 1776
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2014 2:08 pm
Religion: None (Atheist)
Diet: Vegan

Post by Jebus » Wed Sep 05, 2018 3:57 pm

Frank Quasar wrote:
Wed Sep 05, 2018 3:14 pm
What kind of music are you interested in?
This question is not only irrelevant, but any response is likely to distract from the question posed.

The question is: Is there any correlation between any musical preference and intelligence/gender?
How to become vegan in 4.5 hours:
1.Watch Forks over Knives (Health)
2.Watch Cowspiracy (Environment)
3. Watch Earthlings (Ethics)
Congratulations, unless you are a complete idiot you are now a vegan.

Dream Sphere
Senior Member
Posts: 335
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2014 7:52 pm
Religion: None (Atheist)
Diet: Vegan
Location: Greater Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada

Post by Dream Sphere » Wed Sep 05, 2018 5:49 pm

I don't have any scientific studies on this. I remember a vaguely related article supposedly referencing a study on people's romantic/sexual attraction to others based on music taste, where guys who were into classical were percieved less attractive by women than guys who were into metal, and iirc. vice versa for how guys felt about women into classical or metal. I don't remember the name of it, but I could try to find that study or at least the article referencing it if you're curious.

Personally with just my intuition, while I think there may be a correlation between musical taste and gender and/or intelligence, I don't know what comes first in the equation. And I can't say with any level of certainty what types of music are more popular with different types of people beyond my skewed view which is purely anecdotal and prone to my biases and just what I've happened to see which is probably not indicative of the whole picture.

What I mean by what comes first, is does the culture a person's brought up in and becomes accustomed to a result of their intelligence, and does it influence their intelligence? I would guess it's a mix of both, but what's more than the other for each individual I don't know.

I think there're some other sides to the "what comes first" thing too. I mean cliques will shame someone for exploring something out of the ordinary sometimes, but that one person who may want to explore a new means of expression might rationally see greater value in staying in the group over exploring that new socially looked down upon thing depending on the situation.

It's also worth saying valuing one aspect of music over another doesn't indicate less intelligence in the composer/listener (as far as I know) so stuff which focuses on rhythm rather than melodic pitch changes could be relatively as complex in one way as the other piece of music is in another. Then there's also lyrical complexity vs the sound of the music. And even in lyrics there's complexity/intelligence in terms of getting a bunch of meaningful ideas actoss vs the variety of word usage and other similar things. One song could use very sophisticated language without having any significant meaning, whereas maybe a song could have a deep meaning without using very sophisticated language, though I think in some cases to get a particular meaning across then that more precise language is necessary, but very sophisticated language doesn't necessarily mean other aspects of the lyrics are intelligent basically.

To be honest on a personal level, I'm not as intelligent as I would like to be, and I know I'm not anything special. I'm not sure how much of it's emotional/motivation issues, as opposed to ability to process information, but my accomplishments or lack thereof are something I'm really not proud of, and I feel like an idiot for how my life's gone. This is sort of getting at an issue like what is intelligence, is it your abilities once all your parts are summed up? I wonder if just a few minor things were changed about my brain chemistry that I might have a lot more potential as my drive to learn and grow would be greater.

Like with a PC, I think some of my components are pretty decent, but there are other parts of my personality/behaviours stemming from my mind which bottlenecks my capabilities in some ways in certain contexts. An IQ test if formulated in a certain way might get around these issues, I don't know for sure, though.

Tbh, I really tried to make a substantial reply, but from the get go I was really doubtful I had much to add to this thread because I just don't have the relevant knowledge and most of what I could do was speculate and go with my intuition which isn't usually accurate obviously.

carnap
Senior Member
Posts: 340
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:54 pm
Religion: Other

Post by carnap » Thu Sep 06, 2018 2:22 am

Musical tastes is associated with socio-economic status so you're likely to find associations with intelligence and other factors as well but the associations are unlikely to be causal but instead incidental. Musical tastes also play a role in sub-culture formation.

For example someone that listens to heavy metal is far more likely to be working class where as someone that listens to classical is likely upper-middle class.

User avatar
Jebus
Master of the Forum
Posts: 1776
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2014 2:08 pm
Religion: None (Atheist)
Diet: Vegan

Post by Jebus » Thu Sep 06, 2018 2:59 am

Social class no doubt has an impact on what people listen to. However, as intelligence is correlated with memory I would assume that someone with a poor memory would have a hard time appreciating music without a strong catch and would prefer something that sticks in the mind easier.
How to become vegan in 4.5 hours:
1.Watch Forks over Knives (Health)
2.Watch Cowspiracy (Environment)
3. Watch Earthlings (Ethics)
Congratulations, unless you are a complete idiot you are now a vegan.

User avatar
Lay Vegan
Full Member
Posts: 189
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:05 pm
Religion: None (Atheist)
Diet: Vegan

Post by Lay Vegan » Thu Sep 06, 2018 10:14 am

Not sure if the question is even useful. Correlation does not imply causation. i.e., even if men are more likely to enjoy rock music than women, it doesn’t mean that there is some underlying causality between those 2 variables.

I think a much more useful question is: “Is there a causal relationship between music preference and intelligence/gender?”

On the matter of intelligence and music preference, I’d argue that musical tastes are likely influenced by variables like upbringing, social climate, and personality. Neither of which are soul indicators of cognitive ability. Let’s consider that smart people tend to prefer the slower paced, rhythmic sound of brass and woodwind instruments. Does this mean that whatever set of genetic traits that control for intelligence also control for a preference toward Jazz music? Or perhaps do smart people tend to grow up in similar environments that are more receptive of Jazz music while hostile toward fast paced, intense musical genres (like metal)? I'm skeptical that these variables directly affect each other (if you find evidence otherwise I'm happy to change my mind).
Jebus wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 2:59 am
Although anecdotally I sense an intellectual correlation, I am even more curious in gender difference, i.e.men are much more likely to enjoy, for example, prog music than women, in my experience.
:?: You lost me there. Anecdotes are totally useless as evidence for correlation, so that statement holds no weight. Also, what is “prog music?”

To answer your question, the literature seems to demonstrate weak correlations between music preferences and gender but is inconclusive on any sort of causality. Women tend to respond more emotionally to music than men do. http://psycnet.apa.org/doiLanding?doi=1 ... 2Fa0015342 This study found that women, on average, tend to enjoy pop music more than men. http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177 ... 5697252003

I haven't found anything on music preferences and intelligence. Although I'd also guess that more intelligent people look for complexity in their music. Again, how this translates into what choices they make, I don't know. A smart person could enjoy the deft, rather lyrical word play of Hip Hop or the rich symphonies of classical music. Or maybe they could just as easily enjoy the fast-paced, electrical distorted sound of Metal?

This psychology grad student discusses the scientific evidence on this topic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93P8tz653HE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOHFAGZl4a4
Jebus wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 2:59 am
However, as intelligence is correlated with memory I would assume that someone with a poor memory would have a hard time appreciating music without a strong catch and would prefer something that sticks in the mind easier.
You're assuming that memory is the only attribute associated with intelligence. What about music that is more creative and emotionally complex? After all, emotional knowledge is another aspect of intelligence, and intelligent people could just as easily prefer repetition in music.

User avatar
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Master of the Forum
Posts: 1012
Joined: Sun Feb 21, 2016 5:57 am
Religion: None (Atheist)
Diet: Ostrovegan
Location: UK

Post by Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz » Thu Sep 06, 2018 11:11 am

Jebus wrote:
Wed Sep 05, 2018 3:57 pm
Frank Quasar wrote:
Wed Sep 05, 2018 3:14 pm
What kind of music are you interested in?
This question is not only irrelevant, but any response is likely to distract from the question posed.
You mean like this?:
Jebus wrote:
Wed Aug 29, 2018 12:33 pm
Would be better to get rid of the presidency.
Anyway, I think the question is relevant because if you were to respond, we would have gotten some valuable data. We would have learned what sort of music people who have the intelligence of a goat listen to.

Lol jk Jebus I love you.
Jeremy Corbyn is to antisemitism what Margaret Thatcher was to the anti-apartheid movement.

User avatar
Jebus
Master of the Forum
Posts: 1776
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2014 2:08 pm
Religion: None (Atheist)
Diet: Vegan

Post by Jebus » Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:15 pm

Lay Vegan wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 10:14 am
I think a much more useful question is: “Is there a causal relationship between music preference and intelligence/gender?”
Agreed.
Lay Vegan wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 10:14 am
Anecdotes are totally useless as evidence for correlation
Lay Vegan wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 10:14 am
that statement holds no weight
This is an incorrect statement, and it is a very common incorrect statement. Anecdotes carry some weight, just not as much as controlled experiments. The whole work of Sigmund Freud, just an example, was built around anecdotes.

Anyway, that comment wasn't intended as evidence.
Lay Vegan wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 10:14 am
what is “prog music?”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_rock
Lay Vegan wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 10:14 am
You're assuming that memory is the only attribute associated with intelligence.
Not assuming that at all. However, memory and IQ are strongly positively correlated.
Lay Vegan wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 10:14 am
What about music that is more creative and emotionally complex?
What do you mean by music being emotionally complex?
How to become vegan in 4.5 hours:
1.Watch Forks over Knives (Health)
2.Watch Cowspiracy (Environment)
3. Watch Earthlings (Ethics)
Congratulations, unless you are a complete idiot you are now a vegan.

User avatar
Lay Vegan
Full Member
Posts: 189
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:05 pm
Religion: None (Atheist)
Diet: Vegan

Post by Lay Vegan » Thu Sep 06, 2018 1:51 pm

Jebus wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:15 pm
This is an incorrect statement, and it is a very common incorrect statement. Anecdotes carry some weight, just not as much as controlled experiments. The whole work of Sigmund Freud, just an example, was built around anecdotes.
Anecdotes are not useful tools for evidence in science. Relying on such a small sample of outcomes is illogical since the results may not represent the population as a whole. Perhaps in my experience, women are more likely to listen to progressive rock than men. Our statements would be equally valid. Neither would be sufficient evidence that men or women, as loosely defined groups, are more likely to enjoy rock music.
Jebus wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:15 pm
The whole work of Sigmund Freud, just an example, was built around anecdotes
This precisely why Sigmund Freud (and most of the field of psychology) is regarded as unreliable within the academic sphere. Freud's ideas were based on clinical observations rather than empirical, scientific research, and some of his theories relied on small, homogenous non-representative sample sizes. In fact, many psychologists don’t even use psychoanalysis in patients today, and others dismiss it as pseudoscience altogether.
Jebus wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:15 pm
What do you mean by music being emotionally complex?
Music that can illicit strong emotional reactions in people. Whether it be complexity in how the music is produced (composing certain notes and mixing sounds or sequences, or using lyricism and figurative language to convey some implicit message). All styles and genres of music can be complex in this way.
Jebus wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:15 pm
Not assuming that at all. However, memory and IQ are strongly positively correlated.
There may be a correlation of some sort, but I'm curious as to how that manifests itself in musical preferences.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests