Philosophical Vegan Forum

Hello everyone!

I'm fairly new with combining a vegetarian diet with workout and I am quite worried that I might miss out on something. Therefore I'm asking for help from someone with experience. Without going into deep specifics I can say that I workout on an average level? (gym/climbing 4-5 times a week)

The source of food is quite boring (I've no problem eating the same stuff forever):

1,5 cups of rice (Basmati)
3 cups of water
2 medium potatoes
1 medium sweet potato
2 carrots
1/3 of green cauliflower
1 slice of red cabbage
1 root parsley
300g corn
600g mixed beans (chickpea, white beans, kidney beans)
1 fresh medium/big sized broccoli
2-3 heaped tablespoons of curry powder
Herbs & seasoning (salt, pepper, basilica etc)

Usually drink water, sometimes (rarely) milk.

PS: I eat all this in 1-2 days depending on how much I workout & how hungry I am etc. Yes, I take B12 supplements.

Hi, your diet seems to be too high in carbohydrates, and lacking in fat.

I would take out the 1.5 cups of rice and the 2 white potatoes, and replace them with nuts and seeds. Sunflower seeds (plenty of vitamin E) and walnuts (for essential fatty acids) are pretty good. You can also try chia or hemp seeds if you like those and can find them at an affordable price.

You can keep the sweet potatoes, carrots, and corn. Some carbs are fine, you just seem to be overdoing it.
Personally, I would swap the corn for corn tortillas, because that's an easy way to eat more beans.

Have you tried cronometer.com? It helps you plan out your diet to make sure you're getting enough of everything.
Here's a thread on how to adjust the default settings for Vitamin A: https://theveganatheist.com/forum/viewt ... 091#p21091

brimstoneSalad wrote:Hi, your diet seems to be too high in carbohydrates, and lacking in fat.

I would take out the 1.5 cups of rice and the 2 white potatoes, and replace them with nuts and seeds. Sunflower seeds (plenty of vitamin E) and walnuts (for essential fatty acids) are pretty good. You can also try chia or hemp seeds if you like those and can find them at an affordable price.

You can keep the sweet potatoes, carrots, and corn. Some carbs are fine, you just seem to be overdoing it.
Personally, I would swap the corn for corn tortillas, because that's an easy way to eat more beans.

Have you tried cronometer.com? It helps you plan out your diet to make sure you're getting enough of everything.
Here's a thread on how to adjust the default settings for Vitamin A: https://theveganatheist.com/forum/viewt ... 091#p21091

Hi brimstoneSalad!

Thank you for your answer! You're absolutely right that my diet is high on carbonhydrates, however for me it feels like the right amount of carbs to be able to handle work + a postworkout. But that is just how it feels, perhaps I am overdoing it and should cut some out anyway.
I liked your idea of adding seeds, sunflower seeds and chia seeds is something I will try out right away. Nuts are rather expensive here to eat on a daily basis.

I will look into Cronometer.com and hopefully figure out how it works.

PS: I totally forgot to mention that I eat 3x2 eggs (3 for breakfast and 3 after work).

S0urce wrote:You're absolutely right that my diet is high on carbonhydrates, however for me it feels like the right amount of carbs to be able to handle work + a postworkout. But that is just how it feels, perhaps I am overdoing it and should cut some out anyway.

The more important thing is to avoid low-nutrient carbs like rice or white potatoes (potatoes are not as bad as rice).
Corn is pretty low in nutrients too, but if you use tortillas, the utility makes up for it by helping you eat more beans (beans are probably the best food there is).

Anyway, I suggest you focus on whole grain carbs like the sweet potato right before your workout. After, you can focus more on nuts and seeds, and your proteins like beans.

Don't eat too many vegetables unless you're striving for weight loss; the fiber will fill you up and make it harder to eat more beans. I usually recommend around a pound to 500 grams a day of veggies. You can eat an unlimited amount of beans.

S0urce wrote:I liked your idea of adding seeds, sunflower seeds and chia seeds is something I will try out right away. Nuts are rather expensive here to eat on a daily basis.

Peanuts are another option, although not as good as walnuts for essential fatty acids. You need a source of essential fatty acids.

You can take canola oil (low erucic acid rapeseed oil) for essential fatty acids if you're on a budget (it's one of the only oils I eat).
It's better to get it form nuts since they are more nutritious but if you can't afford it, go with canola.

Cronometer will help you make sure you get enough good fat.

S0urce wrote:PS: I totally forgot to mention that I eat 3x2 eggs (3 for breakfast and 3 after work).

I would suggest that you don't eat eggs. After you finish the ones you have, look into getting a protein powder based on pea or soy protein if you can. That's a much better source of protein than eggs (and you don't need to cook it). Eggs are associated with causing a lot of health problems, and are not widely considered healthy foods anymore.

Are you aiming for weight loss, or bulking up?

If you're going for weight loss, stick to beans: they're the best, cheapest, healthiest protein source there is.
If you're going for bulking, the fiber in the beans may make it hard to eat enough of them, so an "isolated" source like a protein powder may be beneficial/easier since you can just drink it.

brimstoneSalad wrote:

S0urce wrote:You're absolutely right that my diet is high on carbonhydrates, however for me it feels like the right amount of carbs to be able to handle work + a postworkout. But that is just how it feels, perhaps I am overdoing it and should cut some out anyway.

The more important thing is to avoid low-nutrient carbs like rice or white potatoes (potatoes are not as bad as rice).
Corn is pretty low in nutrients too, but if you use tortillas, the utility makes up for it by helping you eat more beans (beans are probably the best food there is).

Anyway, I suggest you focus on whole grain carbs like the sweet potato right before your workout. After, you can focus more on nuts and seeds, and your proteins like beans.

Don't eat too many vegetables unless you're striving for weight loss; the fiber will fill you up and make it harder to eat more beans. I usually recommend around a pound to 500 grams a day of veggies. You can eat an unlimited amount of beans.

S0urce wrote:I liked your idea of adding seeds, sunflower seeds and chia seeds is something I will try out right away. Nuts are rather expensive here to eat on a daily basis.

Peanuts are another option, although not as good as walnuts for essential fatty acids. You need a source of essential fatty acids.

You can take canola oil (low erucic acid rapeseed oil) for essential fatty acids if you're on a budget (it's one of the only oils I eat).
It's better to get it form nuts since they are more nutritious but if you can't afford it, go with canola.

Cronometer will help you make sure you get enough good fat.

S0urce wrote:PS: I totally forgot to mention that I eat 3x2 eggs (3 for breakfast and 3 after work).

I would suggest that you don't eat eggs. After you finish the ones you have, look into getting a protein powder based on pea or soy protein if you can. That's a much better source of protein than eggs (and you don't need to cook it). Eggs are associated with causing a lot of health problems, and are not widely considered healthy foods anymore.

Are you aiming for weight loss, or bulking up?

If you're going for weight loss, stick to beans: they're the best, cheapest, healthiest protein source there is.
If you're going for bulking, the fiber in the beans may make it hard to eat enough of them, so an "isolated" source like a protein powder may be beneficial/easier since you can just drink it.

Thank you for the time you spend answering my concerns!

Whole wheat pasta was the main ingredient in my diet for the past year, perhaps I could continue with that? Anyway, as it seems I will be buying quite a lot of different beans and seeds in the future. And I will do my best to stay away from rice, potatoes and eggs (only 2 left out of 30).

I am aiming for muscle gain but not too much gain in weight (I rock climb), but I also want to make sure I get all important vitamins etc.

I'm definitely gonna try canola oil, and I'll try to use Cronometer and complete a chart this weekend.

S0urce wrote: Thank you for the time you spend answering my concerns!

Whole wheat pasta was the main ingredient in my diet for the past year, perhaps I could continue with that?

No problem. And yes, whole wheat pasta is excellent. It's a staple for me, along with whole grain breads (I like the multi grain ones with seeds mixed in, although they're more expensive than pasta).

Oats are also great, if you like those (and cheap).

S0urce wrote:Anyway, as it seems I will be buying quite a lot of different beans and seeds in the future. And I will do my best to stay away from rice, potatoes and eggs (only 2 left out of 30).

Good to hear.
Another seed that is getting cheaper in the U.S. and probably in Canada (if you buy in bulk) is chia seeds. They used to be really expensive, but with the demand, price is coming down thanks to economy of scale.
If you can find that cheap, it's a great seed to use (you have to keep it refrigerated and grind it up to use it, though -- a coffee grinder will do a good job of it; ideally grind shortly before you eat it in small batches)

S0urce wrote: I'm definitely gonna try canola oil, and I'll try to use Cronometer and complete a chart this weekend.

Great, let me know if you're short on anything, and I can give you some recommendations. It's usually pretty easy to fill in the gaps.

I have to say I notice there isn't any fresh fruit in your diet. For me a large banana smoothie is a great start to my day or for after a workout. Dates are good too. Fresh fruit will provide you with vitamin C and other vitamins. A banana + raw spinach or kale smoothie is a very nice way to get in a lot of raw leafy greens that have a lot of protein and iron. Add some hemp, chia or flax seeds for good fats...

In general your diet looks like it has a lot of carbs and protein, which are very important macro-nutrients, but not a lot of vitamins, trace elements, etc.. Try to add more diversity to your diet. Try to add a diversity of fruits (blueberries, kiwi's, but really all fruit is good) and nuts, seeds and also mushrooms are good to add.

There's also a difference between raw and cooked vegetables. Some compounds disappear when heated, others are more bio-available in cooked food... Consider having a mix of raw and cooked veggies in your diet.

Culinary fruit is optional.
Berries are great, although expensive: your best bet is frozen berries.
I don't really recommend other "junk fruits" (like bananas or dates, which are high in sugar and low in antioxidants and nutrients) unless you really like them, can afford them, and then only in moderation. We need vitamin C, but that can be obtained from vegetables.

Mushrooms are amazing, but unfortunately can be pretty expensive. However, if you can find nutritional yeast in bulk that can be an affordable source of fungus protein and vitamins (they're rich in most B vitamins).

You can add some ground mustard when you eat (not the processed condiment) to your cruciferous veggies to add back in enzymes destroyed by cooking. Although Greger has jumped the shark a bit lately, he has a good video on that here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsN8x0BWcyE

One thing I forgot to mention:
TVP, or TSP, that is Textured Vegetable Protein, or Textured Soy Protein can be found in bulk, dry, and it's very cheap (if you buy from the right source). It stores very well and cooks quickly (add hot water), and it's mostly fiber and protein (the fat has been removed). Great source of complete soy protein in a palatable form (add spices).

I happen to know that Broccoli-Mustard soup is very nice.
Btw 'jumping the shark' is such a funny expression if you know its etymology, haha.


But I think giving bananas the epitaph "junk fruit" is a bit over the top
Sure they are sugary, but that gives you nice energy for workouts. They still contain a lot of important nutritional elements and fiber:
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fru ... ces/1846/2
http://www.livescience.com/45005-banana ... facts.html (Claims they contain things that soothes muscles and helps against depression)


I would not recommend eating only cooked stuff, raw veggies & fruit are good for you... I happen to really like all kinds of fruit, why would you say use in moderation? Because of the sugar?

AlexanderVeganTheist wrote: But I think giving bananas the epitaph "junk fruit" is a bit over the top

It's an issue of comparison to other foods you might eat, and the opportunity cost. Of course they aren't bad compared to twinkies, but they're nutritionally poor compared to beans, nuts, and vegetables.
If you're eating fewer beans in order to eat more bananas, you're doing it wrong.

AlexanderVeganTheist wrote: Sure they are sugary, but that gives you nice energy for workouts. They still contain a lot of important nutritional elements and fiber:

Beans and whole grains contain carbs for a workout too, as well as large amounts of fiber, and are much denser in terms of nutrients for the calories: you can eat more of them, and ultimately get more nutrition, without gaining fat.

AlexanderVeganTheist wrote: I would not recommend eating only cooked stuff, raw veggies & fruit are good for you...

I'm not convinced. A few foods have enzymes deactivated from cooking (as explained in that video by Greger), but this doesn't seem to be the norm, and the enzyme can be replaced by adding a little bit of raw mustard powder (not cooking the mustard) when you eat it.

The amount of nutrients lost in cooking is small, and the type of nutrients that are lost are abundant anyway (so, no great tragedy). The nutrients unlocked by cooking seem to far outweigh loss.

I'd eat fruit raw, because Vitamin C is damaged by cooking (and cooked fruit is usually gross to me), but you don't need a lot of it. A couple fruits for the day are probably plenty. More vitamin C is not necessarily better.

AlexanderVeganTheist wrote: I happen to really like all kinds of fruit, why would you say use in moderation? Because of the sugar?

They are high in calories (and from sugar, yes), and not high enough in nutrition to make up for it. Human cultivation increased the sugar content of the worst offenders substantially. The exception is berries, which are more nutrient dense than "junk fruit". Blackberries, for example, do not need to be eaten in moderation (they're lower in sugar, and they even have a lot of protein in them).
Like oil, I think it's good to moderate the sweet fruit intake. It's OK in moderation.

Non-sweet fruit, like squash or tomatoes, are better value propositions in terms of nutrients per calorie.