Philosophical Vegan Forum

Everytime I bring up my advocacy for a socialist system like universal health care, I'm always met with the waiting list problem.

Can someone point me to an argument that would help to solve this problem or a statistic that would mitigate the issue? I can't seem to find anything pertaining to this issue other than anecdote and political theory by news sites (ie. Universal Health Care is bad because I THINK there would be a waiting list problem/There is a problem in other countries) If there is none I am willing to change my mind if someone can provide a good opposing argument/evidence.

Thanks!

Well, it should be hard to defend because it's not a good idea :p

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/431459/bernie-sanders-socialism-attracts-economic-illiterates

knot wrote:Well, it should be hard to defend because it's not a good idea :p

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/4 ... lliterates

This article doesn't refute Universal Health Care/Tax Payer Funded College. Bernie Sanders has shown how he will pay for these programs. I'm just looking for evidence for how to solve a problem within this system. Again, I don't want to be sent articles like this with political theory and sophestry, I'm just looking for evidence. If you can provide statistics or a good argument, then please post here. But if you are going to do exactly what I warned against doing, which is sending me articles of some person's opinion without evidence, then don't bother, because you will be ignored.

Welcome to the forum!
I'm not sure exactly what you're asking for. Are you asking about how universal healthcare might cause people to have to wait a long time for their healthcare?
Well, it's not like people would have to use government healthcare. They could just use private healthcare if they found it affordable, but there should be a safety net for people who can't afford that.

I think that the fact that countries with universal healthcare are happier with their healthcare systems than the US is pretty telling.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/8056/healthc ... anada.aspx

The National Review is a horrible news source, IMO.
It basically called Bernie Sanders (whose family died in the Holocaust) a Nazi, and then denied it.

The National Review wrote:He is, in fact, leading a national-socialist movement, which is a queasy and uncomfortable thing to write about a man who is the son of Jewish immigrants from Poland and whose family was murdered in the Holocaust. But there is no other way to characterize his views and his politics.

But if you are going to do exactly what I warned against doing, which is sending me articles of some person's opinion without evidence, then don't bother, because you will be ignored.

Then it's a good thing the author of that article is a renowned professor of economics from Harvard who bases his opinions on evidence

EquALLity wrote:The National Review is a horrible news source, IMO.
It basically called Bernie Sanders (whose family died in the Holocaust) a Nazi, and then denied it

Were the articles written by the same author?

EquALLity wrote:Welcome to the forum!
I'm not sure exactly what you're asking for. Are you asking about how universal healthcare might cause people to have to wait a long time for their healthcare?
Well, it's not like people would have to use government healthcare. They could just use private healthcare if they found it affordable, but there should be a safety net for people who can't afford that.

I think that the fact that countries with universal healthcare are happier with their healthcare systems than the US is pretty telling.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/8056/healthc ... anada.aspx

The National Review is a horrible news source, IMO.
It basically called Bernie Sanders (whose family died in the Holocaust) a Nazi, and then denied it.

The National Review wrote:He is, in fact, leading a national-socialist movement, which is a queasy and uncomfortable thing to write about a man who is the son of Jewish immigrants from Poland and whose family was murdered in the Holocaust. But there is no other way to characterize his views and his politics.

I'm asking for a solution to the waiting list issue that people always bring up. When I argue for universal healthcare this always gets brought up and I can't seem to find any reliable infomation on how this people could be solved. I guess not everyone needs to have government funded health care if they don't want it, but I think that would lead to people complaining that their taxes were too high, because Bernie Sanders proposed a slight increase in taxes, with the caveat that you wouldn't be paying for healthcare premiums anymore. So in order to solve that problem we would have to get money from somewhere else, unless we want the republicans to have an argument to repeal this kind of plan in the future.

knot wrote:

But if you are going to do exactly what I warned against doing, which is sending me articles of some person's opinion without evidence, then don't bother, because you will be ignored.

Then it's a good thing the author of that article is a renowned professor of economics from Harvard who bases his opinions on evidence

I don't care about whether or not someone is an authority. Renowned professors still need to present evidence.

Cirion Spellbinder wrote:

EquALLity wrote:The National Review is a horrible news source, IMO.
It basically called Bernie Sanders (whose family died in the Holocaust) a Nazi, and then denied it

Were the articles written by the same author?

No, they weren't, but that's not relevant. It demonstrates that The National Review is a BS source.

If they were legitimate, they wouldn't have published it and they would have immediately fired the writer (Kevin Williamson).
He still works for The National Review.

jimf14 wrote:I'm asking for a solution to the waiting list issue that people always bring up. When I argue for universal healthcare this always gets brought up and I can't seem to find any reliable infomation on how this people could be solved. I guess not everyone needs to have government funded health care if they don't want it, but I think that would lead to people complaining that their taxes were too high, because Bernie Sanders proposed a slight increase in taxes, with the caveat that you wouldn't be paying for healthcare premiums anymore. So in order to solve that problem we would have to get money from somewhere else, unless we want the republicans to have an argument to repeal this kind of plan in the future.

He's not just going to give people universal healthcare with those taxes, which will primarily be on the rich and corporations. He's going to make public colleges tuition free etc.. People will be helped in a multitude of ways.

Some people won't have as much money in the end, but it'll be those who can afford it anyway and who are probably using tax loopholes already.

I don't think we have anything to worry about when it comes to public opinion and universal healthcare. Like that link gave evidence for, people in countries with universal healthcare like their healthcare systems better.

I found this about the waitlist, for what it's worth (from a news source that didn't call Bernie Sanders a Nazi): http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archi ... or/281614/