Philosophical Vegan Forum

EquALLity wrote:Ok, maybe most men talk about how women look or whatever, but they don't talk about GROPING anyone.

You'd be surprised

Groping someone is sexual assault.

I guess that depends on whether that person minds being groped or not. Seems like Trump just takes the chance and has gotten lucky that no one pressed charges

I agree that people should care more about policy, but comments like this are relevant, because they show Donald Trump's character and views towards women.

I don't think the story revealed anything we didn't know already, so I don't get why there's all this outrage over it. We already knew Trump is horny 24/7 (true of most men) and has no self-control. The media is really failing hard by focusing on pointless drama instead of analyzing the implications of the candidates' policies. For example, in the debate Hillary implied that women should be paid the same for doing less work than men, which sounds like a much more dangerous form of sexism than Trump's macho persona, but it got zero coverage in the news.

knot wrote:

EquALLity wrote:Ok, maybe most men talk about how women look or whatever, but they don't talk about GROPING anyone.

You'd be surprised

Groping someone is sexual assault.

I guess that depends on whether that person minds being groped or not. Seems like Trump just takes the chance and has gotten lucky that no one pressed charges

I agree that people should care more about policy, but comments like this are relevant, because they show Donald Trump's character and views towards women.

I don't think the story revealed anything we didn't know already, so I don't get why there's all this outrage over it. We already knew Trump is horny 24/7 (true of most men) and has no self-control. The media is really failing hard by focusing on pointless drama instead of analyzing the implications of the candidates' policies. For example, in the debate Hillary implied that women should be paid the same for doing less work than men, which sounds like a much more dangerous form of sexism than Trump's macho persona, but it got zero coverage in the news.

I really hope I wouldn't be surprised.
Are you seriously telling me most guys talk about sexually assaulting women they find hot? Seriously?

That reminds me of when people say, "It's not rape if she liked it." It's sexual assault to grope someone if there's no consent.
By the way, though, I can assure you that nobody wants Donald Trump to kiss them or grab them sexually.
That's why he has to do it without asking.

And, unsurprisingly, there have been women who've pressed charges about this, with details very similar to what Trump said.
Whenever Trump says something outrageous, his supporters say it was just a joke.
But this wasn't.- https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sJa-3wjz3ls

Now we know that Trump treats women as pieces of meat. I guess we knew that already, but a lot of his supporters were denying it.

I don't remember Hillary Clinton implying that, and I seriously doubt she did.

knot wrote:Seems like Trump just takes the chance and has gotten lucky that no one pressed charges

Doesn't seem like that at all. Of course he doesn't grope women without consent. Not even Trump is that stupid. He knows that he's in the public eye and a target for lawsuits. He just thinks it's cool to talk about women like that when he is around guys. I don't know why this surprises all these republicans who are withdrawing their Trump support. After all that he's said, why would this even raise an eyebrow?

knot wrote:I don't think the story revealed anything we didn't know already, so I don't get why there's all this outrage over it.

Hear, hear.

^You accidentally quoted me, that's what knot said.

Trump is not a smart guy. Based on recent allegations, AND old ones, it seems he does grope women without consent.

EquALLity wrote:^You accidentally quoted me, that's what knot said.

Sorry, fixed it.

EquALLity wrote:Trump is not a smart guy.

Smart is a relative term. About a year ago, I started a thread estimating his intelligence and the consensus thought his IQ was a bit above average. He is certainly not smart enough to be president but his IQ may be above average. His kids actually come across as being quite smart.

EquALLity wrote:Based on recent allegations, AND old ones, it seems he does grope women without consent

As always with famous people, such allegations need to be investigated further. Simply her word against his does not mean much.

EquALLity wrote:Are you seriously telling me most guys talk about sexually assaulting women they find hot? Seriously?

No, that's really nasty for men to joke about. I'd really hope that most men don't talk (or even fantasize) about sexually assaulting woman they find hot.

Of course plenty of men likely fantasize and even talk about wanting to doing something sexual with attractive women, that's one matter. It's another matter to specifically joke/laugh about doing this to women against their will; I'd really hope most men aren't like this.

This really does reflect poorly on Donald Trump's character. To no great surprise of mine, in the debate last night he just blew off the criticism with "that was just locker-room banter." At this point there's nothing he could say or do that would shock me.

Lightningman_42 wrote:

EquALLity wrote:Are you seriously telling me most guys talk about sexually assaulting women they find hot? Seriously?

No, that's really nasty for men to joke about. I'd really hope that most men don't talk (or even fantasize) about sexually assaulting woman they find hot.

Of course plenty of men likely fantasize and even talk about wanting to doing something sexual with attractive women, that's one matter. It's another matter to specifically joke/laugh about doing this to women against their will; I'd really hope most men aren't like this.

This really does reflect poorly on Donald Trump's character. To no great surprise of mine, in the debate last night he just blew off the criticism with "that was just locker-room banter." At this point there's nothing he could say or do that would shock me.

I completely agree. There's a huge difference between saying you'd LIKE to do something sexual (consensually) and "I can just grab them by the pussy."

Luckily, it seems like Hillary Clinton has pretty much cemented her lead. I don't think he's been ahead since the RNC convention.
I'm not celebrating too soon, though... This isn't a regular election.

Jebus wrote:

EquALLity wrote:^You accidentally quoted me, that's what knot said.

Sorry, fixed it.

EquALLity wrote:Trump is not a smart guy.

Smart is a relative term. About a year ago, I started a thread estimating his intelligence and the consensus thought his IQ was a bit above average. He is certainly not smart enough to be president but his IQ may be above average. His kids actually come across as being quite smart.

EquALLity wrote:Based on recent allegations, AND old ones, it seems he does grope women without consent

As always with famous people, such allegations need to be investigated further. Simply her word against his does not mean much.

Having a high IQ (which I don't necessarily believe he has just because Ivanka is articulate) doesn't make you rational.
Donald Trump doesn't seem to be very rational about being in the public eye given the state of his campaign.

Yeah, they do need to be investigated to convict him. However, it's pretty likely the allegations are correct. Some of them came BEFORE his statements became public and were strikingly similar to what he was 'joking' about. They also make sense within the context of his career, such as allegations from former Miss Universes.

EquALLity wrote: Having a high IQ (which I don't necessarily believe he has just because Ivanka is articulate) doesn't make you rational.
Donald Trump doesn't seem to be very rational about being in the public eye given the state of his campaign.

I think he does have an above average IQ -- doubtful genius, but he could be, I've met idiot geniuses -- but he's also some kind of narcissist, which makes him probably incapable of critical thinking on many issues.

EquALLity wrote:Yeah, they do need to be investigated to convict him. However, it's pretty likely the allegations are correct.

In the court of public opinion, which is what may decide the election, he doesn't need to be investigated. I think I would be more sympathetic to this kind of accusation if he didn't trot out the Clinton accusers at the debate. He's getting what he's given. That doesn't make it OK, but I don't really feel the the compulsion to speak up for him.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2nwRiuh1Cug

My mom's listening to Simon and Garfunkel, and this song came on and reminded me of the Bernie campaign ad. Possibly the most beautiful and inspiring video ever.
We could've had the best, and we got stuck with the worst. It's so... Agh.

Bernie 2020!
Or Elizabeth Warren. Either one works.