population ethics and the cow that lived a good life

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Jebus
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Re: population ethics and the cow that lived a good life

Post by Jebus »

Gregor Samsa wrote: Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:13 pmIf you think the sum total of life A: cow suffering for its entire existence until being killed painlessly and unaware is somehow better than sum total of life B: cow being happy for its entire existence then being killed painlessly and unaware, then please go ahead and justify that claim.
Seriously?
Gregor Samsa wrote: Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:13 pmAnd please explain how "The killing itself is probably the least bad part of a slaughter house as the animals are probably suicidal already. " is relevant when I specifically said the cow lived a life worth living.
Look again at my original response:
Jebus wrote: Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:42 am The happier the cow, the more negative the killing becomes. The killing itself is probably the least bad part of a slaughter house as the animals are probably suicidal already. It somewhat evens out, consequentially speaking.
What exactly do you think the last sentence meant? Evens out with what??? I don't see any way a reasonably intelligent person could not read this as follows:

The act of killing a cow with a "life worth living" is actually worse than the act of killing a cow with a "life not worth living" as the happy cow has more to lose.

Hence, the killing of a happy cow is not morally justified.

Your initial post was grammatically clear so I don't see how I possibly could have misinterpreted it. If I did, you have not done a very good job at clarifying it.
Gregor Samsa wrote: Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:13 pmYou didn't answer the original hypothetical and then you started talking about an entirely different hypothetical.
Gregor Samsa wrote: Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:13 pmYou never demonstrated comprehension of the question asked. You said "Given the short life, the tragic death which probably involved a great deal of fear, the sorrow experienced by the cow's friends, I think it is safe to conclude that it would have been better if the cow had never lived at all". How the fuck is that relevant to anything I said?
Although not relevant to the original question, it is relevant to the topic at hand. Meat eaters often make the claim that the breeding of farm animals is a morally good thing as they wouldn't have been born had it not been for meat consumption. As I had already sufficiently replied to your original question (as I understood it), I thought I could point this out as a vast majority of people are of a different opinion. As you identified this comment as a motte (although over 90% of people would find it a weak position) you would also have to explain how it relates to my first comment.
Gregor Samsa wrote: Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:13 pmThe Motte and bailey would be you, instead of actually engaging with the harder question posed by the hypothetical, retreating to defending the easy case of a cow that lived a short and tragic life, being aware of its imminent death and having cow-friends that mourned it. That was not the hypothetical posed and it should be clear to anyone who actually bothered to read what I wrote.
You can't have it both ways. If, as you claim, I did not understand your post it could clearly not be a motte and bailey as well as a misunderstanding.
How to become vegan in 4.5 hours:
1.Watch Forks over Knives (Health)
2.Watch Cowspiracy (Environment)
3. Watch Earthlings (Ethics)
Congratulations, unless you are a complete idiot you are now a vegan.
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