Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

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bigbossomni
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Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

Post by bigbossomni »

www.foxnews.com/us/2017/12/27/man-accused-shooting-killing-wife-two-kids-on-christmas-was-famed-vegan-chef-motivational-speaker-report-says.html

Terrible and no not saying his diet was a cause. Guy has been around the block..Just wondering how you think vegan youtubers will respond? Could see gains making a video celebrating it and others claiming this man was never vegan..
bigbossomni
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Re: Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

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damn sorry lag on mouse posted twice im sorry folks
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Lay Vegan
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Re: Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

Post by Lay Vegan »

bigbossomni wrote: Wed Dec 27, 2017 10:42 pm Terrible and no not saying his diet was a cause. Guy has been around the block..Just wondering how you think vegan youtubers will respond? Could see gains making a video celebrating it and others claiming this man was never vegan..
I'm not sure it's worth responding to. Putting emphasis on the fact that he's vegan chef will only give anti-vegan skeptics ammunition.

I can definitely imagine some people using this as an opportunity to discredit veganism. Though (shockingly) it is not within vegan ethics to commit homicide.

He may have had psychological/emotional complications he was struggling with, and it's unlikely his diet contributed to his actions.
bigbossomni
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Re: Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

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ok so what are your thoughts on the terrorist cells such as the ALF,ELF and animal rights militia? They are vegan and have harmed and tried to kill people..are they not vegan ? I'm confused because so many vegans seem to support these groups
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NonZeroSum
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Re: Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

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bigbossomni wrote: Wed Dec 27, 2017 11:38 pm ok so what are your thoughts on the terrorist cells such as the ALF,ELF and animal rights militia? They are vegan and have harmed and tried to kill people..are they not vegan ? I'm confused because so many vegans seem to support these groups
ALF, ELF and animal rights militia are all part of a left-wing insurrectionairy anarchist tradition, when they're not coercing old ladies who own fur farms, they're knee capping nuclear physicists, setting fire to ski lodges, robbing banks, taking hostages etc. It's a vision of revolutionary communism through getting the most thrills out of sticking it to people you feel deserve it the most, and inspiring others to do the same. You have anarcho-capitalists who decry the state for using tax dollars to support animal subsidies, and fascists who try to justify giving total control to the state for arriving at the new utopia of panacea for animal and human life. It's likely a tendency within populism to tack on as accessory ethical/aesthetic niceties to give it a thin veneer of acceptableness.

It's a lot easier to try to stereotype a population who have come to a singular ethical decision than actually grapple with the ethical arguments themselves huh?
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Lay Vegan
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Re: Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

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bigbossomni wrote: Wed Dec 27, 2017 11:38 pm ok so what are your thoughts on the terrorist cells such as the ALF,ELF and animal rights militia? They are vegan and have harmed and tried to kill people..are they not vegan ? I'm confused because so many vegans seem to support these groups
Veganism is not a cult. No one, regardless of one's ethics, is a above criticism. That includes other vegans. As for the insurgent groups you've just mentioned, neither of them are justified. I do not condone violence, coercion, theft, vandalism etc. as valid forms of activism. Not only are these extremist tactics counter-productive to the movement, they're also contradictory to vegan ethics, which is rooted in reducing animal suffering and exploitation (humans are animals too). Oh, and this doesn't help animals.
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Dsalles
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Re: Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

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Lay Vegan wrote: Wed Dec 27, 2017 11:27 pm He may have had psychological/emotional complications he was struggling with, and it's unlikely his diet contributed to his actions.
I object to descriptions of domestic abusers as suffering from psychological problems. The real problem is he hated his wife for leaving him and took it out on her and his children. Abusive, homicidal men come in all shapes and creeds addictions and stages of mental illness. My father was a pescetarian Buddhist and it did not stop him from brutalising my mother.
I think the Vegan ethic needs to specifically condemn domestic violence and all violence against women and children. The homicide rate for women being killed by male partners and former partners is staggering, especially in North and South America, as is the rate of emergency room visits.
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Jebus
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Re: Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

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Dsalles wrote: Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:29 am I think the Vegan ethic needs to specifically condemn domestic violence and all violence against women and children.
Care to explain how this would fit into the vegan ethic and if so why violence towards men is not included.
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EquALLity
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Re: Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

Post by EquALLity »

Dsalles wrote: Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:29 am
Lay Vegan wrote: Wed Dec 27, 2017 11:27 pm He may have had psychological/emotional complications he was struggling with, and it's unlikely his diet contributed to his actions.
I object to descriptions of domestic abusers as suffering from psychological problems. The real problem is he hated his wife for leaving him and took it out on her and his children. Abusive, homicidal men come in all shapes and creeds addictions and stages of mental illness. My father was a pescetarian Buddhist and it did not stop him from brutalising my mother.
I think the Vegan ethic needs to specifically condemn domestic violence and all violence against women and children. The homicide rate for women being killed by male partners and former partners is staggering, especially in North and South America, as is the rate of emergency room visits.
I understand that domestic abuse, and all abuse really, is a very serious problem. I don't see why veganism should specifically condemn it, though, for the same reason I don't see why feminism should condemn racism, or that Black Lives Matter should condemn sexism. They are separate issues.

Also, domestic abusers may have psychological problems... Yes, of course not always, but sometimes. For example, they may have schizophrenia, which gives them delusions about the world that provokes them to be violent (in reaction to a delusion). I am not saying that makes it ok, I am just saying.
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bigbossomni
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Re: Vegan chef kills his wife and children on christmas

Post by bigbossomni »

lay vegan thank you for the kind response. And wow me and jebus agree on something!

Domestic violence is committed by both genders. I know this from some semi personal experience. My little brother was dating this unstable woman on and off for about 5 years. She was a booze hound and would regularly get mad strike at him with bottles ect. He never called the police until one day she could barley walk and he decided to take her keys to keep her from driving since she was so intoxicated. She attacked him and he threw the keys at her and they hit her face. He called the cops and he was the one ending up with a charge! He almost got charged for false imprisonment. The justice system her in the US seems to have a bias with the females. He was bruised from the attack but the state saw no grounds to charge her.

Sorry for the rant but such a charge has ruined his life everyone thinks he's a vile wife beater and this guy has issues swatting flies. He may be up for veganism for all I know.
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