so in the star wars universe I hate both jedi and sith.

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bigbossomni
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so in the star wars universe I hate both jedi and sith.

Post by bigbossomni »

Yes i saw someone make a post about if the jedi are evil or not. But as someone whos seen the original trilogies in cinema and all the other films, I want your input. I think both sects of the force are awful. They are both dogmatic and every galactic conflict in SW has involved the sith and jedi. The jedi have far too many taboos ( attachment, emotions ect) while the sith are far to focused inward ( too much passion, in fighting, blinded by self interest than the big picture) like the jedi are. As someone who read the books every galactic conflict involves these two and countless innocents die in the crossfire. Just want your blokes opinions on hows you'd feel living in such a galaxy? How would you react?
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brimstoneSalad
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Re: so in the star wars universe I hate both jedi and sith.

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Are they avoidable? Since the force exists (isn't that the real object of hate?) wouldn't new sects like these just form if you got rid of the originals?
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Lightningman_42
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Re: so in the star wars universe I hate both jedi and sith.

Post by Lightningman_42 »

I think so. Luke Skywalker tried to develop a new jedi order after the original organization was annihilated by Vader and the Emperor. The Sith were later replaced by the Knights of Ren. Destroy old Force-wielding organizations, and new ones then have the opportunity to take their places.
"The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil but because of those who look on and do nothing."
-Albert Einstein
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brimstoneSalad
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Re: so in the star wars universe I hate both jedi and sith.

Post by brimstoneSalad »

Lightningman_42 wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2018 6:54 pm I think so. Luke Skywalker tried to develop a new jedi order after the original organization was annihilated by Vader and the Emperor. The Sith were later replaced by the Knights of Ren. Destroy old Force-wielding organizations, and new ones then have the opportunity to take their places.
So, you really just have to find a way to destroy the force itself.

Dump a bunch of kyber crystals into black holes so it eats all of the force energy? (I have no idea how this is supposed to work)
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Lightningman_42
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Re: so in the star wars universe I hate both jedi and sith.

Post by Lightningman_42 »

brimstoneSalad wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:02 pm
Lightningman_42 wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2018 6:54 pm I think so. Luke Skywalker tried to develop a new jedi order after the original organization was annihilated by Vader and the Emperor. The Sith were later replaced by the Knights of Ren. Destroy old Force-wielding organizations, and new ones then have the opportunity to take their places.
So, you really just have to find a way to destroy the force itself.

Dump a bunch of kyber crystals into black holes so it eats all of the force energy? (I have no idea how this is supposed to work)
:lol: Uhhh... yeah, sure. Probably not, actually. The Force exists in all living things. Destroying the Force itself (probably impossible to do within SW-universe) would probably kill all life.
"The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil but because of those who look on and do nothing."
-Albert Einstein
bigbossomni
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Re: so in the star wars universe I hate both jedi and sith.

Post by bigbossomni »

in one game knights of the old republic 2. A ex jedi tries to actually severe the force from all living things. I just think if i were an average joe in the star wars world. I'd hate both dogmatic sects because they are the cause of every major war in history
bigbossomni
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Re: so in the star wars universe I hate both jedi and sith.

Post by bigbossomni »

were countless people die take the first death star over a million people were on that station. Most were simply contractors they had no opinion of the empire they were simply trying to make a buck but some kid just blew them away
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Lightningman_42
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Re: so in the star wars universe I hate both jedi and sith.

Post by Lightningman_42 »

bigbossomni wrote: Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:23 pm In one game knights of the old republic 2. A ex jedi tries to actually sever the force from all living things. I just think if I were an average Joe in the star wars world, I'd hate both dogmatic sects because they are the cause of every major war in history
Another KotOR fan on the forum! I liked KotOR 2, but the first game was still better.

The ex-jedi you're referring to is Darth Nihilus (that name, "Nihilus", already says a lot about his character). I'd insist that Nihilus is the most deeply evil character in any Star Wars story. He is a sith lord who experienced severe emotional trauma during the Battle of Malachor V. Was he a jedi at that time? I don't remember. Anyways, as a result of his emotional trauma, he developed a rare Force ability to suck all of the Force energy out of other living individuals, and doing so would temporarily alleviate his suffering.

Nihilus became addicted to this experience, and like an addicted smoker progressing from 1 cigarette per day to an entire pack per day, he gradually increased the scale of his massacres to satisfy his Force hunger. By the time of the KotOR 2 game, he had the ability to kill all life on a planet and absorb the Force from it into himself. By then, he didn't even care about the Sith Order and its ideals. He only cared about satisfying his hunger. "Nihilus", which sounds like "nihilist", is a perfect name for him.

So what does this have to do with the Jedi being evil? I'd say that the greatest moral flaw of the Jedi Order is their commitment to emotional detachment. They think it prevents their members from falling to the dark side, but it really does the opposite. If young padawans in need of emotional support, are told by the masters who've brainwashed them, to "just meditate on id and embrace serenity", then they'll be unable to deal with their emotions in a healthy manner. Darth Nihilus is the epitome of this, but of course Darth Vader (Anakin Skywalker) is the most well-known example. He was a jedi youth who was not given the emotional support he needed, so he became bitter and enraged.


This video gives a great explanation of the moral flaws of the Jedi Order, specifically regarding emotional detachment:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUPD1w78D5I

This video* gives a broader explanation of the Jedi's many flaws:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1vm14itYz8


*Generation Tech did make 2 mistakes that I noticed:
1. From 4:52 to 5:00, he briefly spoke about Ahsoka's trial. He says, "...until she had been kicked out of the jedi order", but she didn't get kicked out. Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't remember those episodes perfectly.
After Bariss Offee (the padawan who framed Ahsoka) confessed to her crimes, Ahsoka's charges were cleared, and the jedi council offered her knighthood. Ahsoka refused, and instead chose to leave the order, against the wishes of her mentor Anakin, and the council. I was deeply impressed with Ahsoka for doing this. She was a 17-year-old girl who had been indoctrinated into the life of a jedi since she was an infant, yet she chose to leave the order for moral reasons (having come to see their flaws).

2. At 6:12 he starts talking about how the jedi don't believe in law and order when dealing with the sith. I agree with this, but he then uses Anakin executing Dooku as an example of this (which I don't agree with). Anakin, however, says "it's not the jedi way" after beheading Dooku, as if to suggest that the jedi would not have approved of this.
"The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil but because of those who look on and do nothing."
-Albert Einstein
bigbossomni
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Re: so in the star wars universe I hate both jedi and sith.

Post by bigbossomni »

Nice I love the KOTOR games too. No darth nihlius was never a jedi if memory serves. Agreed the jedi order has emotional attachment as a taboo which and all force sensitive beings we've seen thus far are sapient so emotions come natural. You should look up the this long video about kriea its about and hour and half long and in depth
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