I guess I'd better make this poll...

General philosophy message board for Discussion and debate on other philosophical issues not directly related to veganism. Metaphysics, religion, theist vs. atheist debates, politics, general science discussion, etc.
Post Reply

Which party would you vote for in the UK general election?

Conservative
0
No votes
Labour
3
60%
Liberal Democrats
1
20%
Green
0
No votes
UKIP
1
20%
SNP
0
No votes
Monster Raving Loony
0
No votes
Another Left-wing Party (please say which)
0
No votes
Another Right-wing Party (please say which)
0
No votes
Would not vote
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 5

User avatar
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Master of the Forum
Posts: 1209
Joined: Sun Feb 21, 2016 5:57 am
Diet: Ostrovegan
Location: The Matrix

I guess I'd better make this poll...

Post by Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz »

Well, here is a summary of the major British political parties:

Major Parties
Conservative - Right-wing, Conservative, Were neutral during the EU referendum, Now supporting a hard Brexit
Labour - Centre-left, Social Democratic, Were Pro-Remain during the EU referendum, Now supporting a soft Brexit
Liberal Democrats - Centre-right, Liberal, Were Pro-Remain during the EU referendum, Now still against Brexit
Green - Left-wing, Eco-Socialist, Were Pro-Remain during the EU referendum, I don't know what they think now
UKIP - Far-right, Populist, Were Pro-Leave during the EU referendum, Now supporting a hard Brexit
SNP - Centre, Scottish Nationalist, Were Pro-Remain during the EU referendum, Now still against Brexit
Monster Raving Loony - Joke Party, Upstaged by the Conservatives, Neutral during Brexit referendum but their position was that the vote should have been on "In", "Out" or "Shake it all about"

Oh my god.
Jamie in Chile
Senior Member
Posts: 399
Joined: Tue Apr 11, 2017 7:40 pm
Diet: Vegetarian

Re: I guess I'd better make this poll...

Post by Jamie in Chile »

I am not going to decide until I see the manifestos (I actually read them) and even then I may not vote, since I live abroad. I have the right to vote if I want.

I hope this election isn't all about the EU. There are serious issues facing the UK and the world like climate change for instance.

Will be interesting to see if the liberal democrats still campaign on going for a 2nd referendum. They were campaigning on it very recently. I'm not sure I'd call the liberal democrats centre right, but you could probably equally argue for centre or centre left.

I don't think anyone cares about the monster raving loonies anymore. It was a bit funny in the 1990s, but it got old.
User avatar
NonZeroSum
Master of the Forum
Posts: 1159
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:30 am
Diet: Vegan
Location: North Wales, UK

Re: I guess I'd better make this poll...

Post by NonZeroSum »

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz wrote: Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:31 am Labour - Centre-left, Social Democratic, Were Pro-Remain during the EU referendum, Now supporting a soft Brexit
Left-wing, Democratic Socialist, Now supporting soft brexit (staying members of the single market) and solidarity with worker, environmental and economic regulations fought for in Europe.
SNP - Centre, Scottish Nationalist, Were Pro-Remain during the EU referendum, Now still against Brexit
Scottish National Party (national not nationalist, representing change from majority rule of Tory gov they never vote for, would split apart the second they got indipendence into divergent party interests) - Left-Wing, Libertarian Socialist, Pro-Autonomy to stay in if one country voted in, which they campaigned for remain and won big, now for Scottish independence within the EU.
Jamie in Chile wrote: Tue Apr 18, 2017 4:37 pm I am not going to decide until I see the manifestos (I actually read them) and even then I may not vote, since I live abroad. I have the right to vote if I want.

I hope this election isn't all about the EU. There are serious issues facing the UK and the world like climate change for instance.
May has gaurenteed that unfortunately, the Tories promised stability and all they've done is cuts and populism.

My prediction:

SNP will increase their majority in Scotland for independence within the EU.
UKIP will increase their votes in Leave strongholds but still only get 1-3 MPs because of PR.
Greens will keep Brighton and maybe add Hastings.
LibDems will increase in Remain strongholds get 1-3 more MPs.
Conservatives will take 6-7 seats off Labour and we'll get 1-2 back off them.

And we'll still be in the same mess the Tories got us into, all so May can stand up in parliament and grandstand that she's delivering the people's mandate so no one can disagree with her.

Stability is a winning ticket, but change always comes around once people realise the lies they've been sold.

Labours polling is awful as a direct result of stunts pulled by labour rebel MPs, but the class destinction is stark and the history of the labour movement in this country strong, very few seats are ever easy to turn.

You can't trust Theresa May in the general election | Owen Jones talks...
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuHFM3-ZuAA
Will be interesting to see if the liberal democrats still campaign on going for a 2nd referendum. They were campaigning on it very recently. I'm not sure I'd call the liberal democrats centre right, but you could probably equally argue for centre or centre left.
I imagine they'll word it as they'd fight for a second referendum on the terms of the deal once negotiated, so by voting for them you increase that mandate, but it's a nonstarter of an idea and will just take votes away from labour. Centre-Right because they are fiscally conservative, they went into coalition with the Tories letting them institute austerity politics, increasing rates of unemployment and cutting welfare to make speculators in London happy, but doing bugger all for industry.
Unofficial librarian of vegan and socialist movement media.
PhiloVegan Wiki: https://tinyurl.com/y7jc6kh6
Vegan Video Library: https://tinyurl.com/yb3udm8x
Ishkah YouTube: https://youtube.com/Ishkah
User avatar
miniboes
Master of the Forum
Posts: 1578
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2014 1:52 pm
Diet: Vegan
Location: Netherlands

Re: I guess I'd better make this poll...

Post by miniboes »

It'd depend on my district, but i would probably prefer the libdems or labor.
"I advocate infinite effort on behalf of very finite goals, for example correcting this guy's grammar."
- David Frum
User avatar
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Master of the Forum
Posts: 1209
Joined: Sun Feb 21, 2016 5:57 am
Diet: Ostrovegan
Location: The Matrix

Re: I guess I'd better make this poll...

Post by Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz »

NonZeroSum wrote: Tue Apr 18, 2017 8:09 pm
SNP - Centre, Scottish Nationalist, Were Pro-Remain during the EU referendum, Now still against Brexit
Scottish National Party (national not nationalist)
I know. I said their ideology is Scottish nationalism. Not their name.

I would consider them centrist because there is a large spectrum within them from left-wing to right-wing. Likewise with Labour, you have the far-left of the party with the Marxists and Trotskyists (I remember when I visited a Labour party conference and I accepted a leaflet from the Labour party Marxists), then you have the moderate left with Corbynites and Bennites, then towards the centre of the party you have Social Democrats like Ed Miliband and Andy Burnham, and the right-wing of the party you have Blarites and even further right is Blue Labour.

Personally, I support Labour and am disgusted by the SNP as they purported themselves to be a left-wing anti-austerity alternative in the 2015 election against Ed Miliband, and when they conquered most of Scotland, they showed their true colours as Tories in tartan, changing their positions on many things (e.g. 5p tax). They stand for a Scotland for the rich, but I wouldn't be able to vote for them anyway because I live in England. The Green Party of England and Wales is also very similar because they put themselves as an anti-austerity alternative, whereas after the election they endorsed plenty of liberal and independent candidates, but STOOD AGAINST socialist Labour candidates. It is a fucking disgrace.

Corbyn must win. The other candidates are nightmarish. Monster Raving Loony looks sensible and reasonable in comparison.
Jamie in Chile
Senior Member
Posts: 399
Joined: Tue Apr 11, 2017 7:40 pm
Diet: Vegetarian

Re: I guess I'd better make this poll...

Post by Jamie in Chile »

I'll put my cards on the table a little bit here even though I'm not yet stating a specific preference in this election. In UK elections it is often the case that even after careful study of all policies and personalities, I find very little if any preference and often don't vote, not because I'm apathetic, but because I really don't see much difference between the candidates.

Conservatives
I have never voted Conservative, but I almost did at the last general election (2015), before deciding not to vote as I live abroad, but had I voted, I would have voted conservative. I think you can trust them a little more on the economy and national security. However, I have tilted personally a little to the left in 2016 and 2017 after thinking more about the environment and how protecting the environment and the planet (especially in the context of global waming) means modifying free-market capitalism in a significant way, e.g. through the introduction of green taxes, something the conservatives are probably not willing to do. Also I don't like May as much as Cameron. The national insurance thing calls into question not just ability to trust a May government, but even her government's basic competence on a simple issue. Her defence of Christianity and supporting of a report that said religious opinions based on faith should be given more weight than others doesn't sit well with me. This is no longer a Christan country. It's time for politicians to move on. At least Cameron stalled on the heathrow runway, while May approved it straight away. The conservatives are probably on the centre ground (or pretending to be) and I think Theresa May's conference speech was a fair reflection of where the country is today. I think if the conservatives win it means maintaining the status quo. A labour win would be exciting, but potentially divisive and scary.

Labour
I have never voted Labour, and often never took them seriously. Under Ed Milliband I think they leaned too far to the left, represending the workers and the low paid but not the whole country. Corbyn I saw asking question after question about tax credits in PMQs, I think labour messed up the system of benefits and taxes so that some people were deliberately living off benefits and there was no incentive to get a low paid job. I think the conservatives have been addressing this by removing benefits and reducing taxes on low paid jobs to create more incentive to work.

You have to work with business leaders. As a landlord that still owns a property in the UK, I'd be worried what a labour government might do in terms of regulations. I think labour goes on about economy/job issues too much, and doesn't actually focus on areas where it could show some more leadership, such as gay rights, feminism, and so on. I do think labour has shifted more left on environmental issues that the conservatives (previously there seemed to be little difference) and if that's the case, I think Labour might be worth another look.

Liberal Democrats
I voted for them in 2010 because they were the only ones with credible climate change policies, but Labour may be catching up. Swore off voting for them in 2015 because couldn't trust Nick Clegg after U turn on student tuition fees.

Greens
Never took them seriously because apart from the green policies they looked like socialists who had no clue about how to run an economy or a country. However, I am more green these days, so would be willing to take another look.
Post Reply